CriminalxMinds @ LJ

1: That is an adorbs macro.

2: This post. I agree with everything in it. I'm not up to date with the show (the last episode I saw was the one that introduces Wife #1, whose name escapes me), but I agree so hard with this. It's part of why I would totally be Wife #4, given the opportunity.

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1. He's so sweet! I don't know if I want to jump him or wish he was a member of my family. Thank you for feeding Dr.Freud there you infuriatingly sweet man!

2. Take a number! I think the line would out Friday Black Friday.

I have to say that I would prefer marrying a man who still cares about his ex-wives than a man who fucking hates them or doesn't give a damn - whose to say it won't be you tomorrow? As long as he's not holding them up as a standard for you that is.

I'm reading through John Douglas's book, The Anatomy of Motives, he talks about guys who kill their whole families before they kill themselves - he pinpoints it as ego, that these guys can't imagine their family still existing beyond his life, beyond his control, that their family don't need him to provide for them. Chief would be the John List case, where he didn't kill himself in the end, he ran away and started another family - but he killed his family because in his egoism, he can't imagine his family going on without him as the stable provider.

Rossi is the the opposite of guys like that, his speech at the end of Omnivore, to Hotch. He knows he can do good, but he doesn't have an ego about his importance, and he respects autonomy.

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2. I totally agree. But we'd all queue up nicely -- nobody wants to be the bitchy one. *grin*

Oh my God, John Douglas is like my God when it comes to crime and psychology. I read Mindhunter, and I swear it changed my life. And yeah, I agree, Rossi is totally the opposite of family annihilators.

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While Dr.Reid, or Dr.Reid/Gubler (hmmmmmmmnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn mmmmmmmmmnnnnnnnnnnn hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmnnnnnnnnnnnn (tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TwinThreesomeFantasy)) have legions of fangirls, I think Rossi is the true Little Black Dress of the fandom.

Okay, I think I have read that one fic where Dr.Reid was Strauss's boy toy (kink meme) and it was kinda hot, but Rossi is just more naturally shippable with EVERYONE than anyone else, LOL!

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Oh god, no, don't send me to TV Tropes! I'd never return!

Rossi is indeed naturally shippable. He's just that hot.

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TV Trope Surfing Tip:

Use Firefox! You will be released from the TV Trope spell when the browser crashes!

I think of both Rossi and Garcia as the sweet molasses that holds the cracker BAU team together - and Rossi have way more experience than Garcia.

I pretty much 'ship' everyone with everyone, in that, depending on the circumstances, I can see anyone get together with anyone. Like hey, if the zombie apocalypse ever visited Glee, Dave/Kurt could totally work (http://archiveofourown.org/users/poetikat/pseuds/poetikat/works?selected_tags[]=13154). ...but well, whether it will End Well is an entirely different matter. It was like, everyone other than Rossi had certain issues, that shipping them, in terms of who and how, is like the riddle with the fox and the chicken and the bag of rice.

The biggest hurdle of Rossi/Anyone as a srs ship, is what's in it for Rossi?

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Except maybe Ashley Seaver, whose existence is strangely the reason why I could started shipping Professor Rossi with everyone else: it's just, Rossi reads as a Dad type, but if Ashley is the one who's his kid, than I can ship him with the rest of the team!

Or baby Jack is Rossi's kid, and now everyone else is good to ship lol.

...but man, I still mostly prefer shipping Rossi with Strauss* or Gideon, or maybe Hotch or Haley.

*He calls her Erin! I totally read a Had A Fling, Broke Up vibe between the two of them lol.

I really like John Douglas's writing. Side-eye a bit at the way he completely dismiss the belltower shooter's tumor, and associated physical causes for people to turn killer, but overall, his writing makes sense.

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Lol, Strauss and Rossi totally had a fling back in the day. That's probably part of the reason that the Bureau has no-fraternisation rules.

Personally, I love shipping Rossi with Reid (blame severity_softly and innerslytherin's "Conscious of Our Treasures" series), but Hotch/Rossi and Rossi/Prentiss are awesome too.

Rossi/Haley? That is an interesting idea...

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I totally want some Rossi/Strauss h/c, like her drinking? D'awwwww.

Just listing Haley as someone closer to Rossi's era, if Rossi knew Hotch for a long time, he knew her too eh?

I like reading Rossi/Reid in the kink meme, especially the kitty ones, let me go find that link...

Golden Years (Expensive sex toys)
Here Kitty Kitty (kitty collar fic)
http://cm-kink.livejournal.com/842.html?thread=245578#t245578

Of Lavender and Peaches (hair washing h/c)
http://ansera.livejournal.com/43578.html?thread=1297978

...but outside of the kink meme, Rossi/Reid just doesn't interest me, it seem so one sided in terms of needs. With Gideon/Reid, it's interesting to me because while Gideon is the intellectual mentor, Reid was the emotional care-taker (prior to Tobias Hankel at least).

Like, Reid is a total fanboy over Rossi's books, but what does Rossi need him for? Ditto for why I don't ship Rossi/Seaver (other than squick), I can see what's in it for her, but what's in it for Rossi?

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I see R/R as being less about mutual need, and more about an equality that can be reached between them, especially in S5 and forward. It really just seems to fit for me, and I can't exactly determine why just yet. Like, Reid is coming into his own as a character -- I can't see, say, S2 Reid tearing the Unsub's father in "The Uncanny Valley" a new one the way S5 did -- and his personality just sort of slots in really well against Rossi's. I'm not sure how else to describe it.

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...I don't ship Rossi/Seaver (other than squick), I can see what's in it for her, but what's in it for Rossi?

You're kidding, right?

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Conventionally speaking, that is pretty (though when I look at that picture, I'm primarily distracted by the question of "Oh god how old is she?"). I think both Rossi and Gideon are primarily attracted to women their age though, so Seaver's young and pretty look isn't going to be something Rossi would start a relationship for...

Like, remember that promise he made to his first wife, about looking out for each other? I think Rossi definitely wants someone who could match him as an equal. (I remember there was a kink meme prompt about Rossi taking an interest in Reid after Uncanny Valley, somebody fill it please!)

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*facepalm*

OK, that reply was mostly a joke, but "what's in it for Rossi" is a Pretty Young Thing paying attention to him. And Rossi evidently has a Bureau-wide rep as a hound.

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Yeah, that reputation was why I used to feel weird about shipping Rossi with the younger members of the BAU, more than Gideon...

...but either he's changed since then or he's one of those guys who sleeps around a lot - but he actually does like everyone of them and it's not just looks.

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Icon. Just sayin'.

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I don't know why, but Strauss's face, Strauss LEERY face, I can see her tucking dollar bills into Rossi's pants.

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That cap is a look she's giving Rossi during one of their arguments in "25 to Life".

It's when she's telling him "You never did understand about politics." and Rossi snarks "Oh, I understand. I just don't care." The look she gave him totally looked to me like she was having a little flashback.

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jeweledvixen.livejournal.com

I would so totally be in that line. I love Rossi. and I agree with your assessment of him.

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runawayroadkill.livejournal.com

Rossi could walk into the BAU with a machine gun and open fire on the team in the next episode and I would still love him.

People like to compare Gideon and Rossi and what I think what sets those two apart is what I love most about David Rossi.
Rossi knows he's an asshole.

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I really don't know how he was pre-Boston, but most of what people read as asshole, are things that Gideon can't help, and he is aware of it, when he's aware of it, like when he apologized to Hotch during Ashes and Dust, that he'll sit with the dying next time.

When we first saw Rossi,he came back well rested after an early retirement he wisely took. When we first saw Gideon, well, he's a PTSD case, which, at the end of "Extreme Aggressor", Hotch the supervisor concluded that he's still not okay as a person, it's just that, he's still functional.

That's the difference between Rossi and Gideon, on the scale of being an 'asshole'. Rossi was well rested, but he was the more well-adjusted and wiser one to begin with. Gideon on the other hand, was damaged - he really should have quit a long time ago (...but I have the suspicion that Gideon 'cheats' at his psychological exams, so as much as I heart Gideon, I also see him as the type of guy who frequently bites off more than he can chew, so even though I heart Gideon more, I would enjoy spending time with Rossi more..).

Frankly, while it's fun to compare them because they actually do have a lot in common*, I wish people wouldn't do it in a I like X too because Y sucks kinda way. Both Rossi and Gideon were awesome in different ways, and blah blah blah I knew real life wrote the script (plus budget means you can't have too many people in the main cast), but I realllly wish we could have gotten to see a CM with both Gideon and Rossi in it, because they are awesome in different ways, and I think they'll play off each other very well. (Like, that speech Rossi gave to Hotch at the end of Omnivore? I think Rossi used to do that for Gideon too, before he quit).

*Chicago, passionate sports fan, loves to cook, not macho, isn't the type personalize rejections / shape their id on other people's perceptions (this is where the perception of them being assholes come in I guess), served in the army, old fashion romantics, religious upbringing, collects classical paintings
...that and the fact that they used to share hotel rooms, is why they are my crack ship lol.

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runawayroadkill.livejournal.com

You're going to have to forgive me as you're always so awesomely thorough with these discussions and I go to respond and my brain is just like *tumbleweed*

Despite my inexplicable bone deep hatred of Gideon I actually agree with what you're saying but...agh it's hard to admit that.
I originally started off watching this series because of the profiling and plotlines but before I knew it I was mostly tuning in to see the characters so my opinion has been completely warped by fandom and shipping. XD

Edit: and wow did lj just let me edit my comment? I better go check my account status D:

Edited Date: Dec. 28th, 2011 03:44 am (UTC)

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chreesko.livejournal.com

LJ's latest update took away the preview option on default comment pages, so they had to give everyone the ability to edit or risk borked HTML/messed up comments all over the place.

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runawayroadkill.livejournal.com

Oh thank god. A bit slow I am. Thanks for letting me know!

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inexplicable

Maybe it's transference. I hate Kate Freelander from Sanctuary, while there are clear cut logical reasons why (um, her character kidnapped someone and sold him to the Evil Corp on the episode that introduced her), reasons that a lot of her fans handwaved as wtf origin bad writing, the fact that I have handwaved similar wtf (Iron Man) but didn't for this character means that there is probably some personal transference going on. It's so bad I stopped watching the series, but hey, kudos for the people who like her character and find something to be happy about, haters to the left!

so my opinion has been completely warped by fandom and shipping. XD

Remembering that tumblr post where someone said their opinion of Gideon was mostly shaped by fanfic, I guess it's time for me to write moar (though goddamn it, I have so many wip in the kink meme it's MEAN.), Gideon fics and Rossi/Gideon fics, because holy fairygodmothers of columbian graded crack, it MAKES SENSE!

...and come now, Harry Potter has a huge Oliver/Percy fandom before those two even have a line in the book together (and in fact, they nevar, but the movie producers were fandom tuned enough to give us a hug in the movie, thank you!).

As much as I like Gideon, I have to say that they way he's been keeping, it was bad for the BAU, and the BAU (or what they dealt with), was bad for him. He couldn't put it down when the case ends. As much as I miss him, as much as I prefer him better, as a beloved character, I have to say that show-wise, and in-universe BAU health-wise, Rossi was better for the team. If only we could have had both though, I think if Rossi had came back earlier, Gideon wouldn't have left like /that/. Rossi would have slapped some sense into Gideon the way he did for Hotch at the end of Omnivore, or he would have told Gideon that it's okay to quit the way he told Jordan so he didn't have to leave like that.

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chreesko.livejournal.com

Rossi knows he's an asshole.

This. I mean, not that exact point (though I do agree) but the idea that one of the things that sets them apart is Rossi's self-awareness. Not only of his flaws, but of his role as a cog in the machine. I find that aspect of his character very interesting, since he seems so much more outwardly arrogant and ostentatious compared to Gideon's more unassuming appearance, at least at first glance.

And yet Rossi is the one who makes an effort to recognize his flaws and sometimes even works to correct them so that he can better fit into the world (his sudden transformation into a guy who's all about the team, for example) whereas Gideon expected the world to change to accommodate him. I know there's been a lot of discussion of the show playing with stereotypical gender roles, and I think they're sort of doing the same thing here by playing with our expectations of certain character types and the tendency everyone has to judge a book by its cover.

You wouldn't think that Rossi, of all people, would be the one to give Hotch the the-world-will-go-on-without-you speech (though I do think some of that was just him saying what Hotch needed to hear in that moment), and yet he is. And I think he even sort of believes it because, hey, he did leave, and the job did go on without him.

I don't know, I just think the transformation he's undergone over the years has been kind of cool. Even though the job is incredibly gruesome, working with the team has had such a softening effect on him. It's smoothed out his rough edges a little. He'll still try to buy his way out of cheap motel rooms while the rest of the team has to suck it up, but when it comes to the really important things, he's there for them. The David Rossi of 2003 wouldn't have been.

Not that he wouldn't have been capable of it; the potential for that interaction with the team was always there, if we look at the relationship he maintained with Carolyn. I do think his remaining friends with his first wife (and the fact that she came to him to help her commit suicide) speaks to his loyalty and the incredible friendship they must have had, but I'm actually not sure that could be said for his other wives. People don't remain static, and it could have been that he became so consumed by his job or his trauma or his ambition that he was quite the asshole to wives #2 and #3.

OP, adorable macro is adorable. That cat.

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I don't think Gideon so much expects the world to change, as he expects it to be a certain way, if that makes sense.

You know how there are some unsubs (most actually) who are driven by sexual fantasy?

I can't see Gideon being one of those guys, if he snaps, and I can very easily see him snap the way I couldn't see Rossi snap, he'll be that Mercy Killer guy who kills to preserve innocence, like in nebula99's Angels:
fanfiction.net/s/3331405/1/Angels
Gideon would do that because
1. Gideon is driven by the desire to protect
2. Gidoen is driven by the belief that there is no one else who could protect him or what he loves (beliefs that are hardly baseless, but welll...).

Rossi in the same situation wouldn't have done that, because Rossi is, as his ex-wife have noted, not the type of guy who could kill (take power), AND Rossi is all about autonomy. I read both Gideon and Hotch as the rare kind of sexist who don't have a misogynist bone in their body, but they do put women (especially the women in their personal life) on a pedestals. Rossi, in a subversion of the Italian Macho Male stereotype, doesn't do that.

...but back to fantasy, while Gideon is not the kind of creeper who is driven by sexual fantasy, because Gideon is not a very sexual person, there is a fantasy he's driven by, in spite of knowing otherwise: happy endings. He doesn't expect the world to change, whether, he compartmentize the horrors he sees and maintain a delusion that the world is a better than it is - typical of people who have experienced great trauma as children.

Word Smith I Ain't (other than purple posy porn), oldwickedsongs puts it way better than I ever could:

Title "Lonely Ghosts”
Author oldwickedsongs
Characters Dave Rossi, with a cameo by Jason Gideon and mentions of the team.
Rating PG
Word Count 1,302
Summary A character study of the hunter and watcher: in which we find triumphs are never without reminders, and just because someone is gone doesn’t mean they’re erased.

http://oldwickedsongs.livejournal.com/3212.html

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Also, I didn't make the adorable cat macro, it was in my cat folder! (yes I have a folder full of cat pictures)

Edited Date: Dec. 28th, 2011 04:25 am (UTC)

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Dunno if this is teh one true sauce:
http://pinupmgg.tumblr.com/post/5466092529/catblocking-rossi-always-alert-with-a-fresh-cat

...but excellent caption from pinupmgg:

"catblocking rossi: always alert with a fresh cat on hand"

We Mad?

No.

(deleted comment)

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chreesko.livejournal.com

The Hotch-Rossi dynamic works so much better, because it doesn't seem like Hotch is constantly propping him up. More equal.

I just rewatched Riding the Lightning, so this really stuck out for me. Hotch is so much more authoritative now than he was then. And I noticed that in some of the scenes where Rossi advises Hotch or acts as a confidant, there is often a lot of physical space between them, like in the hospital scene after Hotch was stabbed, or the counseling scene in Hotch's office after everyone thought Prentiss had died (though some of that space was probably supposed to symbolize how isolated Hotch was from everyone), or in Hotch's office when Rossi was trying to get him to go out with Beth, or in that one deleted scene from S4 where Rossi asks Hotch about how he's doing after Kate's death.

The only time I recall Rossi and Hotch getting touchy with each other during scenes where Rossi is imparting wisdom was the alley scene in Omnivore, and even then, there was a fair amount of space between them. It seems like, by allowing that space, by standing back and giving advice and then letting Hotch work through it himself, he's being the advisor and letting Hotch be the leader.

Gideon, on the other hand, was usually all up in Hotch's space, both physically and mentally. In that sense, I think he was more intimate with Hotch than Rossi is. But while he knew him well, he never really knew how to advise him. Gideon would use himself and his own reactions as a template for what Hotch should or shouldn't do, which was a bad idea because Gideon was pretty screwed up. It goes back to his lack of self-awareness, I guess. Rossi recognizes that his dysfunction shouldn't be an example for others to follow. He may not know exactly what Hotch is thinking at any given moment the way Gideon sometimes seemed to, but he's better at recognizing what Hotch needs and how to give it to him.

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