Discussion Post: Vigilantism

[gen-is-gone.livejournal.com]

So, the show has had quite a few would-be vigilantes over the years (A Real Rain and Hotch's actions in 100 coming most readily to mind) but specifically in regards to Regina in Unknown Subject, there were quite a few comments saying the Emily shouldn't have deceived her, and even some that said Regina should have been allowed to murder her rapist. While I agree that the Piano Man was a despicable person, and his crimes warranted his hatred, I found slightly off-putting the idea that one of our team members would condone revenge murders, especially given the past anti-vigilante themes on the show. So my question for you is this: what stance do you think the show has taken in regards to vigilantes and revenge killers, and do you agree?

Comments

[dhae_knight_1]

So... You don't believe there's a difference between breaking a law to save a live in clear and imminent danger, and breaking the law to take a life which isn't a clear and imminent danger?

Or do you believe that the people you are talking about are a clear and imminent danger without them actually being about to attack anyone?

I see where you're coming from, and I agree that someone will never change, but... I don't like the thought that everyone are, by definition, viewed as someone who can't change.

[gsyh.livejournal.com]

Patterns of Behaviour: There is an unsub who likes to revisit his victims, eventually killing them when he feels he could not control them anymore and/or they grow too old for him. He's obsessed and determined. His victims are concerned with staying alive and living life, and growing up, keeping jobs, going to school, meeting their friends. He has none of those concerns, what is most important to him is getting to his victims, and he has patience. For example, Timothy Wilson Spencer, who would heavily restrain his victims beyond just tying the wrist, would choke them for hours - one of his victims was 15-yr Diane Cho - control was important to him so he would stalk his victim of choice for days, once he had selected them from the mall, for the opportunity, for when they would be alone.

Diane Cho's family was in the same house as her when she was raped and tortured to death by Timothy Spencer, he watched her enough to know that her family would not disturb her in her room because she was studying, and that she took the screen from her window so she could lean out and talk to her friends. He watched her enough to know when she'll sleep and when her family would sleep so he could do it while they were in the room next to hers, because he was determined.

You have this kid who was assaulted by the unsub, his innocence is not in question. Twenty years later he gets paroled, for good behaviour in prison. He found a bible study group, earned a degree, stayed clean - he was taking drugs and he was very messed up before he was arrested, and kept clean, in prison where he was watched. So he gets released, even though during the trial and shortly after he was imprisoned, he had express intention to finish what he started...and in the past, he had always lived up to his word on this, he tried to get help sometimes but he always relapse.

He's released from the authority of prison, he's on the registry, but no one is watching him 24/7, he comes and goes as he please.

Is your kid in clear and imminent danger? Ya gonna bet on this?

[dhae_knight_1]

Do I believe it's possible he's changed in 20 years? I have to. I have to believe people can change; can work to better themselves, can work to overcome their issues and move on with life.

And part of that is that I think ex-convicts needs to be given the chance.

I know that the US has a different view on punishment than we do in Denmark. Here, we believe that once you've done your time you are, in essense, an innocent once more. We focus on re-educating convicts (not that we're terribly good at it, so far), because we believe that most criminals don't actually get less criminal by being thrown in jail to rot. Most criminals get less criminal by being educated and helped to get a job.

This, of course, is not the case with every type of criminal, and works better with minor offences (violence, robbery and so on). And, obviously, not every criminal wants to give up their crimes. Rapists is a good example. Still. I do believe that most people, even those screwed up by their pasts, have the potential to become good people who don't want to hurt anyone. The few who don't... well. That's what mental institutions are for, isn't it?

So... To sum up. No, I wouldn't say my kid was in clear and present danger. The day she sees him looking in her window is a different story all together. Still doesn't mean I would shoot him, but I would definitely report it to the authorities.

[nwjarvis.livejournal.com]

Reminds me of a conversation in an episode of the old show "The Unit" (I seem to be full of quotes today.)

Sgt. Gray: So, you don't believe people can change, Top?
SMjr Blaine: Nope.... Seen it, though.